Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Quiz FFF members on fishing and outdoors topics using the forum polling function
Post Reply

Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Yes
59
88%
No
8
12%
 
Total votes: 67

User avatar
ghound
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 1157
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2006 2:57 pm
Location: Bee's Creek

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by ghound »

Matt

Problem with being able to purchase special rape and plunder passes is if the stocks are in dire straits why undermine efforts to replenish them to help a select few?

Problem with charter licenses going up in value is it makes me crook to think the user group most responsible for the state of the fishery (in my view) is going to profit the most from the state they have put it in.

As for AFANT a lot of what I have said has an element of tongue in cheek . However in my view they are primarily by people who are from a sports/barra fishing background and I don't think they represent the average weekend warrior to well. With the obvious exception of my big mate 2 rods. Proof of this is the member number is poor considering the participation rate in the territory.


User avatar
AM
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 1986
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by AM »

Matt Flynn wrote:
There have been some good issues raised on this thread, there's no easy answers. There are some comments I don't understand ...

*Why the problem with commercial and charter operator licences going up in value if there are no more entrants allowed in? I assume there is a reason for this and it's not just ill feeling towards these sectors.
What Ghound said but add this. when the stocks continue to decline and the next step comes with costal line out of the Darwin Zone altogether, lets calculate the quantum of their individual compensation packages on the figures they gave for this survey. The amount of fish they say they caught compared to rec fishos wouldn’t feed one of them let alone the whole fleet for a year. When they are asked to prove up how much money a year they will lose when they start talking compensation packages, then you might start to get a feel for how many fish they really catch. AM

*What is the problem with the big charter boats or others buying a permit for an extended bag limit for fishing spots that are half way to Indonesia? (Not an official proposal by the way, as far as I am aware). Sounds good to me if they are fishing further away, there's not going to be as much pressure in close. And because it costs a fortune to go wide and weather is a limiting factor, presssure on the wide grounds from charter boats will not be anywhere near as great as near Darwin. Not many trailer boats will be going to Tassie Shoal etc.
The logic here is that if a rec fisherman who normally fishes in areas beyond or on the verge of the "Darwin zone" much of the effort of those trips will now be redirected at more economical locations back within the zone and quite probably very close to Darwin, precisely where we would not want them on the stocks that are in the most trouble. Like it or not, not everybody has the money to support the idealistic approach that dropping a grand on trip can be justified if the best take home senario is thirty fish, many (if not most) people I know wont go that far.They will have to fish closer to home due to economics. If you offer them an olive branch then it may take the pressure back out of the "Darwin zone " where I assume we are trying to put it. It is true that this may be something that the guy in the 14ft tinny cant afford but it is a resource and one that has a value. Is he likely to ever get to Emu reef or flat top banks in the 14ft tinny anyway, its been done I know but I would rather be forking out for his trip than mine. AM

Also, the actual NT fisheries proposals are currently only for tighter possession limits, and education about barotrauma. Discussions about other restrictions have come from elsewhere. Whether the proposals change remains to be seen.
I regard the possession limit theory as having an element of futility. Think of how many people will be catching less fish. Not enough for snapper and Jew to make it back if we listen to the growth rate stuff. The survey results are cr.p the possession limit alone wont save the snapper.
In relation to Barratrauma here is another line of thought. I am at Elizabeth river boat ramp yesterday, part of the feel good message on a new sign at the boat ramp is " IF YOU CATCH A FISH KEEP IT AS IT WILL PROBABLY NOT SURVIVE" even if true (and this is in the Elizabeth river not the Bathhust Trench) WTF... have they gone completely mad giving advice like this.

In relation to the barratrauma v maximum size debate my fishing partner brought up an exeptionally good point sitting in the boat yesterday. If your on a good bite of snapper at least and had to throw back a small snapper, who cares if it will die later it will be alive long enough to do the jungle drums thing and the rest will shut down. Surely that will be the best outcome possible, and there is no denying it is the way it goes. AM


The comments about AFANT are disappointing, they have done a hell of a lot for recreational fishing, if someone has an issue with AFANT policy or action then they should get on the phone and let them know, or write to them, the feedback would likely be taken into account. As for the coloured AFANT shirts comment - checkout the Daly during the run-off it, sometimes it looks like a mardi gras ran into a pensioner's convention :lol:
I stand by my comments about AFANT they had to do something and in my opinion what they have supported wont have the outcome they are hoping. I have only brought them into it based on the fisheries data and information brochures offered up on these threads, quoting AFANT as having had an instrumental role in formulating the control measures that have been offered up officially. The fisheries have offered up AFANT as having sanctioned these measures as being there favoured policy and as such the sentiment of NT rec fishing as a whole. If this is not the case or if AFANT recommended a different strategy then they should broadcast that fact instead of enjoying the kudos. Like Ghound I think there heart is in the right place and they do a thankless job, do they have my membership money, no and this issue has done little to change my mind on that. AM
User avatar
Ben Jam
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 1590
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:20 pm
Location: Darwin

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by Ben Jam »

http://www.ntnews.com.au/article/2012/1 ... tnews.html

This is only going to work if people are playing the game!!! Not like the fair additude on this fella.
----------------------------
-----------------------------
mako
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 744
Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:46 pm
Contact:

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by mako »

Its not just about snapper and jewfish, reef fish stocks in general are down, also the average sizes are down, tricky snapper used to be much bigger than they are now, especially around Point Blaze and the Peron Islands.
cuddlescooper
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 3116
Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2010 1:23 pm
Location: Darwin

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by cuddlescooper »

mako wrote:Its not just about snapper and jewfish, reef fish stocks in general are down, also the average sizes are down, tricky snapper used to be much bigger than they are now, especially around Point Blaze and the Peron Islands.
Yep, and 2 fish that would be reasonably easy to put a size limit on and a bag limit would be Jacks and Red Emperor. The research of places like WA and Queensland suggest that Red Emperor dont suffer baratrauma and can be released from depths up to around 40m. Jacks are generally caught in shallow water when juvinile and are usually only caught when fully grown on the deep reefs so baratrauma wouldnt effect them much if a size was placed on them.

Trickys will be another hard case to find a solution to in my oppinion as they are found on all grounds and are very susceptable to baratrauma.
User avatar
AM
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 1986
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:33 pm
Contact:

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by AM »

Surprising lack of interest.Even though
125 posts only 66 people bothered to
register a vote. Pretty obvious answer
to question though I guess.
User avatar
Mud
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 3596
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2009 3:47 pm
Location: Darwin
Contact:

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by Mud »

Think you're right am......the answer seems obvious but the question seems a bit meaningless which is why I didn't vote. Downn from what and when? Down in terms of what? What you'd expect from a managed fishery? From what you'd expect from a pristine unfished system? It's just a tool to get the discussion going. And its going well. And it needs to.
Its not a crisis unless there is blood around.
If there is blood around......well its a police matter...
nomad
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 5762
Joined: Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:29 pm
Location: PALMERSTON
Contact:

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by nomad »

Mud wrote:the answer seems obvious
I agree.
There are still 12% who dont think there is any problem
Fish Tank
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 519
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 4:12 pm
Location: Nightcliff Foreshore

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by Fish Tank »

cuddlescooper wrote:
ghound wrote:Feel a bit sorry for the poor bloke with a 14 foot tinny and 15hp motor in all this. You know the bloke that goes out and catches a couple of poxy snapper for a feed? AFANT is being run by a bunch of colored shirt wearing posers that don't give a toss about the everyday bloke trying to catch a couple for a feed. Ill tell you one thing for free if they bring in some cr.p about paying for a license so you can go on a three day slaughter fest as long as you pay a fee there will be an outcry. Shouldn't be about money,size of your boat or how pretty your shirt is. If the stocks are in as bad a way as they say there should be a blanket ban on catching them anywhere for five years (all sectors). And while there at it trickies reds and trout should be reduced baglimits now so it doesn't get to this stage with them as we'll.
Hey GHOUND.....Wanna here something funny.....I agree with you! :lol:

At least I agree with the blanket bans bit. I find it wrong that you should be able to pay more to rape the seas. That just makes us as bad as that island up to the north that are happy to grab money for a resource from the rich and taking the opertunity away from the not so rich, segrigating the people that is trying to protect the resource in the first place.

As for bagging AfANT im not so sure, at least they are having a crack at achieving something. They have done well with the barra Fishery. Unfortunatly reef fish wont be that easy and we are already well behind on the forgotten species of the reefs. :roll:
I agree with GHOUND and AM. AFANT have lost touch with the very people they are here to represent. They did not support recreational fishermen with the snapper and jewie sustainability findings instead suggested the rec fishermen need to change their ways. There was no suggestion from AFANT that commercial and charter fishing industries had anything to do with the depletion.
Recently sent them some emails regarding my thoughts on their submission to the government on the Chambers Bay commercial closure. AFANT are proposing to make the Mary, Chambers and Finke Bays “lure and fly only” . With this proposal AFANT have stopped advocating for rec fishing freedom and have begun advocating for restrictions on recreational fishing. I think this is a very unthoughtful proposal. I believe they hadn’t thought through all the repercussions i.e. bait fishing the Jewie Reef and the reefs around Cape Hotham and Pt Stuart and using live bait to catch barra in the system. AFANT thought there is no one using live bait to catch barra in the Mary because you can't use nets (you can catch tarpon without nets). They admitted there was no scientific or sustainable reason for the "lure and fly only" proposal but told me that it was a trade off to have the closed season removed. I don't know about you, but even though I don't often use live bait in that system I would still like the option when "lure and fly" methods fail.
Maybe their time would be better spent trying to regain access to the north Tiwis rather than trying to impose more restrictions on Chambers and Finke bays?
User avatar
ghound
Jedi Seadog
Jedi Seadog
Posts: 1157
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2006 2:57 pm
Location: Bee's Creek

Re: Are Darwin snapper and jewfish stocks down?

Post by ghound »

Exactly right fish tank. Big problem with AFANT is the majority of them are strictly barra fisherman (lure only). As is human nature they seek to feather there own nest rather than support the rec fisherman as a whole. While members of the charter industry can be members of an "amateur" fisherman a association it is a farce anyway. The sooner the government realizes that this association doesn't speak for the majority the better off we will all be. I'm pretty sure Millsy and the misfits will be a one term government and when they p..s of I hope they take AFANT with them.
Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to “Fishing Polls”