Two strokes for sale.

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wonderwobler
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Two strokes for sale.

Post by wonderwobler » Sun Nov 08, 2009 11:14 pm

The latest feel good idea is to ban 2 stroke outboard engines in Australian waters.
Federal Gov. is being pressured to make an announcment in Coppehagen in December.
Stock up on 2 stroke oil or sell soon.



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Post by Matt Flynn » Mon Nov 09, 2009 2:31 am

News reports suggest that the only things they will agree on in Copenhagen are the VIP menus and wine lists :mrgreen:

Should they choose to pick on two-strokes I expect it would be a phase-out that means you can use your two-stroke until it dies.

I can't imagine they'll get such a ban through when modern two-stroke emissions are much the same as four-strokes. But you never know.

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Post by BarraBeast » Mon Nov 09, 2009 2:59 am

holy smoke batman.

what about my 2 stroke whipper snipper, lawn mower, motocross bike, missus vibrator, the chainsaw and that snowmobile I always wanted? guess they will all have to go "e-tec" style like Bombardier.

it all seams totally in vein when you have China building 4(on average) coal burning power stations every bl..dy week.

we don't have the luxury of time anymore. build as many nuclear stations as we can, while alternatives are coming on line, and deal with the waste properly. i reakon we have the space for it.
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Post by BarraBeast » Mon Nov 09, 2009 3:34 am

2 Stroke Future
The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) imposed emission restrictions on snowmobiles in 2006, which put limits on the levels of carbon monoxide (CO) and hydrocarbons (HC) that could be present in the exhaust. There was no imposition of what type of engine manufacturers could use. If a two-stroke engine could run clean enough to meet the regulations, it would be accepted.

When emission regulations were applied to on-road motorcycles in the mid-1970s, all manufacturers switched to four-stroke engines for their bikes. Almost 40 years later, the 600 H.O. E-TEC has considerably lower CO emissions than any four-stroke snowmobile engine in production. The E-TEC engine brings a whole host of innovations, including an easier cold-start; electronic oil injection; a fuel-cooled engine management computer and a push-button summerization procedure.

The outboard motor industry went under regulation in 1998. Most manufacturers quickly converted to four-stroke engine designs, but they received backlash almost as fast because engines were heavier and more expensive.

Now, virtually every outboard manufacturer offers both two- and four-stroke engines. The one manufacturer that stayed exclusively with two-stroke engines for its outboards is BRP and its Evinrude brand. The E-TEC direct injection system was developed to meet the emission standards while providing less weight and good performance and fuel economy at a lower cost than competing four-stroke engines.

Other Direct Injection Systems
In the early 1990s, an Australian firm, the Orbital Engine Company, developed a two-stroke automobile engine that met then-current U.S. emissions requirements, exceeded the four-stroke fuel efficiency numbers, weighed almost 200 pounds less than a four-stroke that produced similar power, vibrated less than an equivalent four-stroke and cost from $300 to $500 less to manufacture.

Needless to say, the transportation industries got excited with Orbital’s demonstration. Ford Motor Company, General Motors, Mercury Marine, Outboard Marine Corporation, Polaris Industries, Bombardier — and likely many other engine manufacturers — soon bought patent licenses to use Orbital’s concepts for clean two-stroke development programs.

Automobile companies around the world have launched direct-injection projects, many of which don’t include Orbital’s design. The variety of concepts being developed is impressive and each one seems to confirm the ability to overcome the perceived two-stroke bug-a-boos of suffering from poor economy and high emissions.

Mercury Marine uses Orbital technology in its two-stage, direct-injection two-stroke outboards. The Dodge Neon car was originally slated to have a direct-injected, two-stroke engine, but development of the engine was delayed and a small four-stroke went to production.

Polaris has license to the Orbital patents and has been working on two-stroke engines that are cleaner than its current Cleanfire semi-direct injection systems. Arctic Cat is committed to two-stroke engine designs for its snowmobiles and it is working on direct injection designs.

Yamaha builds two-stroke outboards with High-Pressure Direct Injection (HPDI). The 200 HPDI engine has twin, high-speed fuel pumps that pressurize the gas up to 1,000 psi, and then inject the fuel after the exhaust ports are closed. The system is similar to injection systems on diesel engines.

The 2-Stroke Of Tomorrow Is Evolving
Research continues by companies that have purchased license to use Orbital’s technology and GM, Ford and others have developed two-stroke designs of their own. Most of these engine designs utilize crankcase scavenging (crankcase pressure is used to push exhaust gasses out of the combustion chamber) and total-loss lubrication systems (oil essentially becomes part of the fuel charge). All designs scavenge the cylinders only with air, incorporate some means of varying the exhaust timing, include a multiple-chamber cylinder head and utilize air-assisted fuel injection.

French automaker Peugeot and its concept two-stroke engine incorporates a poppet valve that seals a pre-combustion chamber until fuel is delivered. Rather than use a separate air pump to supply the air-assist for injection, Peugeot has placed a second reed valve in the crankcase that allows air to escape into a chamber, which is then used to assist the air for injection.

Chrysler and Subaru have both developed two-strokes that stray further from the traditional two-stroke concepts. Rather than use the crankcase as the scavenging pump, they both use a belt-driven blower or supercharger to scavenge the cylinders. The crankcase remains a wet sump design like most automobile engines.

Transfer ports carry the air to the cylinder and the piston handles the valving of the ports. In Subaru’s design, an exhaust port in the cylinder is opened and closed by the piston, but just downstream of the port is a rotating valve that boosts the cylinder charge to more than atmospheric pressure. Air assist isn’t needed because the 1,000 to 1,200 psi fuel pressure rating automatically atomizes the fuel as it leaves the injector nozzle.

The biggest, most complex and heaviest of the conceptual automotive two-strokes is Toyota’s design. The engine is basically one of the company’s dual-overhead cam, four-stroke engines converted to run a two-stroke cycle. The camshafts run at crankshaft speed and air is delivered to the intake valves through a supercharger. Fuel is added through a high-pressure, direct-injection system. An in-line, six cylinder, 244 cubic-inch version of this engine is said to produce torque equal to GM’s 454 V8.

The motor vehicle industry has invested in a lot of two-stroke development and it’s not done. The success of the low emission two-stroke engines of today will suggest what will happen tomorrow. Will we see new two-stroke designs take over in the dirt bike market again? Will new two-stroke designs power ATVs again? Will Yamaha adapt its outboard HPDI system to snowmobiles? Who knows?

What I do know is that the new, clean two-stroke engines of today outperform the four-strokes in almost every category of performance with less weight and fewer complex, moving parts.
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Post by Bracey » Mon Nov 09, 2009 6:13 am

A bit more info on the subject from a Qld's perspective.
http://www.sweetwaterfishing.com.au/For ... l#msg17182

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Post by wonderwobler » Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:20 pm

Considering the info provided in this thread 2 strokes with carbies will be the targets for the ban.

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Post by jabsy » Mon Nov 30, 2009 12:49 am

Hmm they should do a buy-back. It'd be a great chance for me to upgrade...

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Re: Two strokes for sale.

Post by Geobec » Mon May 21, 2012 10:24 pm

I bought my 75HP Etec in 2008 and so far I had one little injection problem (which was retified promptly under warranty) - and yes warranties exist in Darwin... to date have just over 600 hours on the motor.. Apart from this other injector problem, I have had no other problem. So, really can't fault the Etec. However, I have also researched the other models such as the Suzuki and the Yamahaha... (that "In & Out of your pocket" sell) sorry, highly recommend, and the Suzuki have bought out some great light weight motors in the recent two years... such as the Suzuki 80HP..

So, as the competition narrows, perhaps us boaties may see some spin off wtih regard to outboards engines. I have been told by a reliable source that merc-cruiser are one of the chosen inboards - but should consider the diesel alternative as a very serious option.

Cheers

Geobec

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Re: Two strokes for sale.

Post by Basstad » Tue May 22, 2012 12:59 pm

I'm with Barra Beast.......... Go with the Nuke outboards idea !.......

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Re: Two strokes for sale.

Post by goldfish » Mon Dec 19, 2016 10:56 pm

Ban on all petrol powered craft will be next like some impoundments in qld
Tight lines 'n' keep the shiny side up people.

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