Global warming

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ronje
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

The corrupted science IS settled in its corrupted state. Its been corrupted by some scientists to arrive at a desired conclusion.

The ice cap on Mars is shrinking (melting).Not a well known event is it? Why haven't scientists said anything about it?

Its important because Mars has NO co2 which to nominate as the cause. There's no CO2 on Mars to cause " Mars warming" 'cos there's no martians to make it. No volcanoes. Nothing.

So why is the pole warming to the stage that its melting? If its not martian made CO2 then what is the cause?

The most logical answer is that the melting is caused by increased radiation/heat from the sun falling on the planet.

Some radiation hitting Mars (and Earth) waxes and wanes with the Sun's 11 year sunspot cycle that Matt was referring to.

But the biggest changes are caused by orbital changes. On Earth its the Milankovitch cycles.

On Mars its the...………. (Buggered if I know but I DO know that its NOT CO2 'cos there isn't any).

Mars suffers from similar orbital influences from the other planets (including Earth and Sun) as the Earth does from the orbital influences from the other planets (including Mars Sun).

Ponder why Greenland was called Greenland 1000 years ago. Because it was covered in green ice?

Nope. Learn why.

Be interesting to see how Mars orbital patterns compare to Earth's. Might do that.

Meanwhile, have a look at this link. No, its not Greta's cousin doing the talking.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDOgWeTAas0


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Ronje
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Re: Global warming

Post by west head gummies »

well you see,it all comes down to the folding stuff.no body especially a coal mine owner wants to stop mining the cash cow. even though less than 1% of the labor force is in this mining industry and most of the income made dosnt even find its way to the ato. ha lol were all mugs and the libs cant even pronounce climate change. when the worlds banks stop lending to new coal and gas projects as they are now ,you know its the end. renewables are cheaper and sustainable . get this into your heads.insurers are also bailing out and without the coverage new mines are doomed. its all about acidifications of oceans co2 in the atmosphere that havnt been seen for 300.000 years .banks are giving away money atm so invest the money into hydrogen and the 10 .5 billion industry it will build for Australia and economy,employ more people and more revenue in Australia so its a win win for all of us.but im afraid that until the last bucket of hydrocarbon is mined the environment may just topple over and mass extinction of vunerable species . so grab your boardies go to Hawaii be the legend ,wait it out for the fires floods and famine to pass while Australia burns. will be interesting to see if we get another bad wet season ,cheers not a scumo supporter.
ronje
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

There's one view.

Lets burn all the money 'cos it seems that's what its all about it. THAT'LL fix it.

300,000 years of measuring CO2 eh? Wonder what the occupiers of the "basin of human life" (Southern Africa) measured the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere with 300,000 years ago?

A wooden diving rod made of 2 crossed sticks?

What is it that's common to both Mars and Earth because they're both suffering from the same problem......….planetary warming.

Well, it ain't CO2 'cos Mars hasn't got anything that makes CO2 and its polar caps are still melting right now.
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

West Head Gummies

Bit heavier than I intended.

Lets just agree to disagree about the cause.
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

Had a look at Mars similarities to Earth.

The polar ice caps ain't ice. They're dry ice which is frozen CO2 doesn't melt. It sublimes... (changes straight from solid (dry ice) to gas (CO2)).

So Mars does indeed have CO2 in its atmosphere and it changes from solid to gas and back to solid again in cycles aligned with.... Mars orbit.

Nothing manufactures extra CO2 on Mars. Just recycles what it has left. Over billions of years, a lot has leaked off into space due to Mars lower gravity ( about one third of Earth's) and lower atmospheric pressure.

ALL of the other planets (including the Sun) have differing tilt, eccentricity, gravity, rotation and atmosphere pressure so I now don't think that looking at other planets is going to help us work it out here on Earth (although it is interesting).
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Re: Global warming

Post by Matt Flynn »

The American Petroleum Institute (API) knew back in 1980 how bad the CO2 problem was and sent this memo to its members ... https://insideclimatenews.org/sites/def ... 980%29.pdf

Not only did fossil fuel companies acknowledge the coming problem, and predicted the effects, which are now happening, but they built infrastructure to account for rising sea levels, here's an excerpt from the many allegations in this court paper ... https://www.sheredling.com/wp-content/u ... icus-1.pdf

Begins ...

"By the mid-1990s, efforts by Exxon and other Defendants ... to deny and discredit the scientific consensus on climate change were reaching maturity, with millions of dollars per year being paid to scientists and front groups to assert that climate change was not real, that fossil fuels had nothing to do with any temperature increases that were being observed, and that a variety of theories — that the Defendants knew were not valid — were responsible for global warming. Yet in 1994, when planning the Europipe project jointly owned and operated by Shell, Exxon, Conoco, Total and Statoil, the companies took sea level rise and other climate impacts into account in the design of the natural gas pipeline leading from a North Sea offshore platform to the German coast. In a document submitted to European authorities, the companies noted the impacts of sea level rise and the likely increase in frequency of storms as a result of climate change. While recognizing climate change as a “most uncertain parameter,” they determined that the pipeline should be designed to account for climate impacts.70"

Meanwhile, from the API memo mentioned above ...

Likely impacts
- 1C RISE (2005): BARELY NOTICEABLE
- 2.5C RISE (2038): MAJOR ECONOMIC CONSEQUENCES, STRONG REGIONAL DEPENDENCE
- 5C RISE (2067): GLOBALLY CATASTROPHIC EFFECTS

The planet is now "officially" at 1.1C above normal. Anyone paying attention to recent heat records falling can see temperatures in some areas are going up fast. It was well understood that the Arctic would warm fastest and that is what is happening.

It is a dark credit to the fossil fuel industry and some media that they have been able to effectively spread disinformation out there, in the face of formidable facts, while their own predictions were printed in black and white in the fossil fuel industry's own communications.

The oil industry is now sewing doubt into the use of renewable energy and electric vehicles, an example is here ... https://blog.ucsusa.org/samantha-housto ... sachusetts

Deforestation from fires and drought was a predicted effect of global warming, we are now seeing this across the world, trees are also dying in high latitudes because warm winters don't kill off the borers and other pests.

What's all this to do with fishing?

That should be fairly obvious!

Bit more to read here if you can be bothered ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ExxonMobi ... ontroversy

Meanwhile, Norway just had its warmest January day at 19C (it's winter in the northern hemisphere) and Jakarta is awash from torrential rain, with dozens dead and massive flood damage ... https://twitter.com/bmay/status/1212594 ... 53345?s=21
ronje
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

How climate hysteria has been manufactured.

I'll put up a couple of graphs when I can enter all the temperature data since 1880, to show you what all the fuss is about.
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

What do we know about the "Horse Latitudes"?
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Re: Global warming

Post by Matt Flynn »

You are brave Ron if you are still holding the line that this warming is part of a normal cycle. We are supposed to be moving into an Ice Age, and yet the planet is warming fast. The Arctic and northern hemisphere heating is happening faster than expected. and permafrost is turning to permasludge. Wind speeds are increasing and the predicted bushfires have been beyond most expectations.

Loss of Arctic ice will see the heat that has been going into melting the ice then go into heating the water. Water heats up fast once the ice is gone.

Interesting times.
ronje
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

Horse latitudes.jpg
The horse latitudes (red lines) are actually bands much wider than what lines represent.

https://oceanservice.noaa.gov/facts/hor ... tudes.html

Yep.

What's happening right now is exactly what happens as part of a long term cycle of climate change. Warming and all.

Its even more pronounced when 2 other cyclic changes reinforce the main one.

The horse latitudes are 2 belts of high pressure circling the earth at between 20 and 40 degrees. 1 north of the equator and 1 south of the equator.

As the earth starts to sit upright, the position of these belts changes on the earths surface.

What's contained within those belts are eastward marching high pressure systems which now march across different parts of the surface of the earth.

In the southern hemisphere, these high pressure systems revolve anti-clock wise.

As a high pressure system approaches from the west, the leading face has s/e winds pushing towards the equator. The air from the south is convected north TOWARDS the equator.

Change the position of those belts ( they form up a bit further north - closer to the equator) and the convecting air that they funnel towards the equator, is warmer as its picked up from not so far south.

Warmer air is then being funneled TOWARDS the equator by the leading edge of the hp system than before.

The top of the hp system is now closer to the equator. On the trailing edge of a hp system, the winds are northerly (FROM the equator).

Because the top of the hp system is now closer to the equator than before, the northerly winds are now much hotter and drier. We get drier conditions and that means droughts and bushfires in places further south than what's been experienced before.

There are a couple of existing deserts which have formed as a result of the changes in location of the "horse latitudes".

1 in South America, 1 in North America and the 2 most significant ones are in Africa and Australia.

The Sahara Desert is smack bang on the northern hemisphere horse latitudes as is New Mexico/Nevada in the US.

Ditto for South America and Australia.

These deserts are extreme examples of what happens when the global wind patterns change.

Climate change.

ALL of these deserts are "on the move".

At the poles, warmer equatorial upper level air is convected to them by the 3 belts of pressure systems. Hot air rises at the equator and descends at the poles as it gives up heat to the polar regions.

As it gives up its heat, the descending air cools and convects south. In giving up heat to the ice at the poles, what happens in those polar regions?

Their temperature rises.

How does the warmer equatorial air get to the poles?

Via the 3 pressure belts earlier.

Earthward flowing warm air (the white lines pointing towards the earth) ensures that the region around where they come to ground is made drier and warmer.

That 30 degree north latitude is where u'll find the Sahara Desert, the Middle East, China's Gobi Desert and the US New Mexico/Nevada Deserts.
Convecting hot air.jpg
Is the science settled? Not by a long shot.
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Re: Global warming

Post by Matt Flynn »

A very interesting post Ron, as always, ty.

I believe the CO2 and methane doona we have made the planet will heat things up regardless. It's nice to think science can be terribly wrong though, they said the chance of thylacines being alive is 1 in 1.6 trillion yet we had two of them on our farm in 2012.

Record heat, record fires and increasing wind speeds are hard to ignore.
ronje
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

U know what has pi...ed me off so much about this?

The way that "science" jumped on board with the alarmists much too early. Those alarmists then immediately claimed " The science is settled! The science is settled!"

And anybody who disagreed with that was deemed a heretic. Then started a modern day version
of the Salem witch hunts of 1692 and the long running muslim anti-infidel attacks.

Chamberlin's famous "Peace in our Time" paper waving photograph after talks with Adolf Hitler shows what happens with appeasement.

The science is NOT settled at all, yet the religious fanaticism of the " mankind has caused global warming" brigade still persists.

While we have appeasement being exhibited by significant parts of the community, there'll always be disagreement and sometimes conflict.
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Re: Global warming

Post by Matt Flynn »

I do hope you are right Ron, but there's just so much data now supporting the predictions. The big concern is the momentum in the system and leaving it too late to reduce emissions, some already think this point has passed.
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Re: Global warming

Post by NinjaFish »

Hah. Good to see this cracking along again. :cheers:
ronje
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Re: Global warming

Post by ronje »

some already think this point has passed.

Only the alarmist brigade.

If science had carried out what the community had trusted it to do, they'd have taken the community along with them on the journey in search of the facts.

Instead, science allowed itself to become an accomplice of the radicals and thus lost the confidence of the people.

So why now should the people retain confidence in the science which has betrayed them?

A pox on the "house of science".
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